043 Hustle and Grind with Sylvie Gil

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Really honored to have Sylvie Gil on the show who has been shooting weddings for 20 years at a very high end level. She has a background in fashion and commercial photography and gives some really great advice to photographers trying to make it in the biz.

Check out her work - https://www.sylviegilphotography.com/

And her workshops - http://sylviegilworkshops.com

Below is the transcription of the episode:

Sylvie Gil: 01:11 Hi Braedon, how are you doing?

Braedon Flynn: 01:13 So good. Well, hey, you have a wealth of knowledge and for those of you that don't know Sylvie, she teaches amazing workshops in France where she's from. But I want to sort of just dig into a little bit of your story and I've got a lot of other stuff I want to ask you. But could you, for people, I know you have a background in fashion, commercial photography and then got into weddings, but can you talk, we don't have to go into like depth of when you first started, but maybe like starting out in commercial photography, then how you ended up in weddings and what that transition was like. Yeah.

Sylvie Gil: 01:42 Yeah. So I wanted to be, I basically wanted to be an artist, but I wanted it to be an artist that is um, you know, doing well financially, find a way to just like make the art, you know, just a good financial experience so, and make money. So I went and studied, um, advertising in Paris and uh, I became an account executive. So I learned how to sell a product and had to create campaigns and things like that. And then I came to America and I was really bored with the advertising end of things. So I started working as a commercial photographer and I shot campaigns for, for fashion in studio. And that was going really well until I got pregnant. And when I got pregnant, you know, as if you look at it, most of the fashion photographers are males. It's very difficult to be a female photographer in fashion because your work, these super long hours and you can never be a mom.

Sylvie Gil: 02:35 So, and then I had a friend and in the fashion studio that I was working at, I had a friend who was, who was photographing weddings and she showed me this beautiful book of wedding photographs and this was in the early nineties and he was wearing black and white photographs of wedding. There was just super gorgeous. And I, and you know, I'm a sucker for anything romantic. And I was like, wow, I just want to try that out. So I, uh, actually had a friend was getting married in Napa and I shot their wedding and that's how it all started. And I loved it. And this was 20 years ago,

Braedon Flynn: 03:07 20 years ago. So it went from, so let's say shooting that first wedding, because I think a lot of people listening are wanting to end up in photography. You're doing that full time, getting that first job versus then getting, you know, more jobs. And how did, how did that end up happening? Like where you'd now started having a wedding business?

Sylvie Gil: 03:26 Well, so I did the first wedding. I was fortunate enough that I was able to use the internet. So I created a website immediately, which was in the very beginning of it. This was the early nineties. And I think that was probably one of the first, you know, like people that I knew what a website and uh, the wedding got picked up by a magazine in Canada and uh, they actually created a story with me and a couple of other photographers just based off like one or two weddings I had shot. And then the phone started ringing from there and I just set up the business, you know, hired some help immediately and just created a brand. And which is different today than it was back then. And just, I remember the first year I shot about, 25 weddings. Isn't that crazy? Yeah, that's amazing. And I know the first year and then I went on shooting about 30 weddings for probably like 15 years, 20 years, 15 years. And then I kind of slowed down a little bit after that. But basically, yeah, most of my weekends, spring, summer and fall, we're shooting weddings and local.

Braedon Flynn: 04:30 That's a really great little story.

Sylvie Gil: 04:32 Yeah, I know. It was really fun. Well, you know, the fact is being a photographer back then was not popular it because it was a lot of like these posing situation going on, you know, it's like, Oh, look at your bouquets sitting on your arm, blah, blah blah. So if you were doing something really different, which I was because 80% of my work was black and white, um, you were becoming popular really fast and, and it's the same today. If you're going to do something a little different and really be what you're doing, um, you can, you can, you can do well, you know, but, uh, that's, I think that's what it was. It was just like, there were a lot of really super, you know, posed photographers that, you know, that did the superposed, super stiff work. And I was doing more like, you know, the JFK kind of look, you know, JFK wedding look, you know, I love the black and white, super grainy and I was shooting film of course, 35 millimeter film. Yeah. So it was working.

Braedon Flynn: 05:26 Yeah. That made just out. We'll get back to your story, but just as a little segue, basically what you said was how it was easy back then to stand out doing, you know, just some work that's a little bit more creative or photo journalistic or stylish. But what do you, what do you think of today? Like, because you educate young photographers, if there's like, how do you suggest someone stands out today? Because I mean you have your style and you do you, but for someone who's out there and they're looking at all these different, who they look up to, maybe yourself, mate, you know, maybe some of the other names out there. How do you suggest people sort of be themselves or stand out?

Sylvie Gil: 06:05 I really think that you have to explore your artistic side. I mean, if I look at my work, and it's interesting because in my office we have the whole history of my work. It's really changed over the last 20 years. And I'm very happy about that because honestly, if I look at any artists out there with other painters, sculptures or whatever, they go through periods, you know, and, and so I had my black and white period. Now I'm very much in love with color because I should this beautiful film and I have this amazing lab, but every once in a while I like the black and white. I mean there's the, it just kind of wounds. Sometimes it's a little more fashion oriented. It's sometimes a little more artistic, whatever, like a painting. So, um, I think that if you really love what you do and if you really find a, an identity, uh, you know, sort of like a signature in shooting, you can really stand out from the rest of the people.

Sylvie Gil: 06:54 And what I suggest to the people that come to my workshop is to just practice, you know, like go out there, take your sister, put a winning down on her and just, you know, try her out in all forms of, you know, any kind of lighting, any kind of situations. See what you love, you might just like when you get the photos back, what I would do and what I did for years and I still do. If I see an image that I really love, I put that into my Sylvia's favorite folder. And then I studied that image. Like, why do I love that image? Why is it that, you know, I love, what's the lighting in here, what's going on here? And then I really tried to imitate that shot, you know? And also I'm, so, it's a constant evolution. Like if we could look at Sylvia's favorite folder for the last, you know, 15 years, it's changed a bunch, you know, and, and, uh, sometimes a decree discover things that I never thought like a blurry shot.

Sylvie Gil: 07:43 Like for example, like softer photographs. The first one was a huge mistake, you know, and I was like, God, I love the movement in this folder. Bride is going by, there's a little movement. It's really pretty. It's Mike Michlin. I think that it's experimenting and then really looking at your images and kind of curating your favorite work and just going from there. That's what I really believe it works. And, um, and then another thing I was going to say, um, which was I don't try to work for the client. I really tried to work for what I think is what I love to do because otherwise after 20 years I would still be doing this. Right. You know, so I don't work for, and I don't try to create trends or anything like that. I really tried to create images that make me really happy.

Braedon Flynn: 08:28 How do you communicate that to the client or do you communicate that to the client? Because I've been, I've been having a funny thing in my own head about calling brides and grooms clients because it's like they're not really, there are, there are couples, you know, but, um, for, for the couples that you're shooting in, you, if you're saying that you're shooting for yourself and not for them, obviously you have a style. So they're trusting you to be able to come up and do some incredible work. But that something that you communicate to them or is it just sort of what you do?

Sylvie Gil: 08:59 You know, I have a really hard time finding words to describe my work. I always have. So when the client asked me that question, which they do, can you please describe your work? I always tell them,

Braedon Flynn: 09:12 yeah,

Sylvie Gil: 09:13 I, I don't, I feel like my images should be talking for themselves and like go to the website, look at every single image and if you like everything then it's, it's a, it's a good, it's a good place to be. If you don't like the images and you're just hiring me for my name, they don't to hire me, you know, or you know, it just makes sure that you really liked the images. And then I said in how, and I actually asked them, how would you describe the images? And they're like, oh, they're like this, this, this. And I'm like, well then you got it. Because I have a hard time describing the work with words. So it just sort of like them make their own, you know. But I do tell them, I'm like, you really should love everything you see that I've done because you have to trust me for those eight or 10 hours in that day to like, you know, document your wedding with the eye, you know, with the eye that you really want to document it. You know? And I said, and, and I, I just tell them that and sometimes they were like, yeah, that's true. You know, like I've see some, they see some websites and they're like, well, you know, and like half of it. And I'm like, well then it's not the right person for you because there was really a trusting thing going on. Like you have to trust each other.

Braedon Flynn: 10:17 Yeah. I, this is more for the listeners out there and something that made me think of that you just said is something that I did for a period of time was I just what I guess what you've been doing is ask clients, like what, what is it that drew you to my work? Or what is it that you see in my work? Just out of curiosity because you know it, as that was happening, obviously people are inquiring, but it was really interesting to hear the results because some of what they were seeing, a lot of people would, initially they were saying it's like, Oh I really love your candid images. And for awhile I was like, what? Candid images because like there's nothing necessarily on my website or blog at the time that's candid and as like, oh I get it cause I, I'm dirt very directive and I direct so much of what I'm shooting. But the, the, the photos that I'm really drawn to are the ones where I've directed them to look really natural and Candida, you know? But I think, I think by asking couples or other people what they see in your work, I think that really helps you solidify the things that you do well maybe.

Sylvie Gil: 11:17 And you did for me. Yeah. And I think it's like that for any artists. They have many friends that are actual artists and they just create a, there are, and then they wait to see what the, you know, the art critics are going to say about it. And sometimes, you know, they feel like, you know, that's Kinda like, how do you say, identifying, you know, there are, and, and that's exactly what it is for me. Like I was here certain wars when people describe my work and I'm like, oh my God. Yeah, that's, I love this description. That's exactly how I shoot in my heart. But, but, uh, I think it's a little dangerous, stupid words into your visual art. I think it's a little dangerous because you might confine yourself to a thing

Sylvie Gil: 11:54 and, and uh, I think it's about how the people read it and they're, like, you say, some people thinking that you were just like shooting candids. But the fact is that you're an posing the client to get that beautiful, natural, organic and unique shot, you know, have a special moment, but they don't know you got there that way. They don't know you took the back door. Do you know what, yeah, no, totally. But then it also helps in selling to the clients because I can then describe to them as, hey listen, this is what you've connected with, but I help you get there. You know, this isn't just magically happening. Yeah, I, I help you be comfortable and I help you be not, you know, so it was able to really go, oh okay, this is what they're looking for and this is what I helped them get.

Sylvie Gil: 12:33 Yeah. So yeah, so I think it's a really important thing to just like, you know, a curate great your work and just really create that amazing folder of images that even like if you looked at it every day, every week for the next year, you was just so in love with it and you're just sitting there going like, oh my God, I'm so good. Or are you really loved this image? And it doesn't matter if it's different than what everybody else is does. Actually, it's probably a good thing, you know? And then just kind of start shooting from there and let the viewer decide, you know, what, what this work is about, you know, or how I represents you. But it's really what gets you going, gets you through to get the best images. I mean, the worst case is just to go and look at someone else's website and tried to figure out how do they do this and how am I going to do this?

Sylvie Gil: 13:17 Like that, you know, which is your heart is not into it and, and it's, it's not ever going to be a really striking image, you know? No, I totally agree. And I guess just in case people are hearing differently than what I understand that you're saying with doing you at the wedding versus doing what the client wants. Because I think some people maybe when they're younger in their business, they might just be trying to be really artistic and just trying to get images for themselves or their portfolio versus actually taking care of the couple versus what I think you're doing is you, obviously you've been doing it for 20 years. You, you know how to shoot a wedding, but you're, you're really doing it in a way that is still taking care of the couple but doing it in a way that resonates with your heart.

Sylvie Gil: 14:02 Yes, exactly. So I feel like, I mean the client hires you based off the images that they see, you know out there that you've created. If they don't give you the space to create those images, then they're not going to happy with what you delivered to them. Right. So I really feel like going to a wedding, for example, if they want to have a couple session, you have to go and scout the venue and take a look at the places because the way in the venue, the tree you would pick or I would pick would be completely different. You and I, and it's important that you pick a location that is going where you're going to have the space to do the work and you know that, that they expect from you. So, one example I was giving, as you know, Jewish ceremonies happen at sunset often and clients are like, well we want to do all the photos after the yeah, after the ceremony.

Sylvie Gil: 14:47 It's like, no, we're going to have to flash everything. And if you look at my website, you know, like that's not the kind of work you want from me. So we need to, you know, work with the schedule. We need to work with the location, we need to make sure we have enough time at this venue so we can get some really beautiful, candid and natural shots. And I'll just like get off the car for three minutes, take a photo, get back in the car, you know. So there was a lot of talk where you gently, you have to gently lead your client, enabling you to deliver the, the beautiful work they expect. And you'll have to sort of gently, you know, lead them or you know, you're not, you're not forcing them to do anything, but you have to discuss it with a client and say, listen, this is what to deliver this photos. This is what I really need right now and how can we work on with that.

Braedon Flynn: 15:34 Yeah, pre-production is really key. And I'm curious for a lot of the students you've had, other photographers you've had come through your workshops, do you feel like when you talk about how much you'd work with a client on the pre-production or, or even, you know, the wedding planner, do a lot of photographers, I feel like a lot of photographers sort of just show up and shoot instead of doing that. Do you find that that's the case and people are sort of surprised at how much work you do?

Sylvie Gil: 16:00 Yes. Yes, absolutely. And I think a lot of people just show up and shoot because they're intimidated by a conversation with a wedding planner or they're in Vr. They even too shy to say, you know what, I'm not going to be able to take good pictures in these conditions. You know, and, and they do. What they don't understand is that they're there. They're not doing the bride of favor because the bride expects the work that she sees on the website. And if they don't do this, there are basically not doing the bridal favors. So it's important, you know, and to just find a way to tell the bride until the planner, hey, this is important. Like, you know, I don't, this is not going to work for me because of this and that reason and how can we find a better solution? You know, it's, it's, they want you to create the fried once you to just deliver the work that you know that you're really good at doing.

Sylvie Gil: 16:50 So you'll have to find a way to do that. So, yeah, so a lot of my students, they come to the workshop and they're like, oh my God. So I'm like, there's phone calls. Like I talked to the bride a couple of times before the wedding there emails, of course the wedding planners is always included. We discuss, you know, their schedule. We discussed the locations. There is scouting. Sometimes I go scouting months before if I really am, you know, um, is shy about a venue or if I'm unfamiliar with the venue. But all of that goes on and, and it's not, I think that the bride and the plan are actually appreciative if you make that effort because they feel like you're really care.

Braedon Flynn: 17:25 Yeah, and I, I would say even even on a lot of wedding planners who do this a lot and have been in the business for years, they don't always have in consideration the lighting, you know that it's just one of those things that doesn't really cross their mind. They understand like once it's dark, it's dark, but, and for brides they have no idea how long things things take and so being able to come in there and advice because you're then either setting, you're either allowing yourself to be set up for failure, knowing that going into it, you're going to be stressed, you're going to hate them, you're going to feel bad the whole time. Or you've set everyone up for success. Adding in a little bit that's like, yeah, if we just got your dress on an hour earlier, we'd be able to accomplish this and this and there'd be no stress.

Sylvie Gil: 18:07 Yeah. I mean things like for example, the venue, since it is supposed to be 7:00 PM, you go to the venue and you find out the venues in a valley, meaning sunset, they're going to lose all your light at six maybe five 30 so yeah, knowing, knowing and being in control is a very important part of it and usually appreciate it and, and yeah, and I don't think it's a good idea just to show up at a wedding and shoot

Braedon Flynn: 18:30 sort of transition from there a little bit. You and I sort of talked about this offline, but wanting to hear, it's just more of your journey and I feel this is something that I keep talking about in the podcast is I really have a heart for the individual who is running their own business as a creative person. I photographer for example, where a lot of it, you're alone, you're doing this by yourself and you're comparing yourself to everybody else. But I, I like to hear bits of stories from people who are doing really well in the industry and basically looked up to like, what have been some of your struggles along the way. And I know like maybe even early on when you're first getting going and your young kids and all that. But yeah,

Sylvie Gil: 19:17 so basically, as soon as I started, I had to make a living, so I had to shoot a certain amount of weddings per year no matter what. And I had to do it consistently. So even when there were recessions, like in 2008, and before it was, I just couldn't just not make money and, and sit on my butt and it didn't work. So what I did is from the beginning, I always had financial goals that I created. This is how much money I need to bring in to support my family and my kids and, and you know, and, uh, and these financial goals had to be met. So I had to book weddings until I reached the financial goals. And then after that, it was icing on the cake. And if I wasn't reaching the goal, I would just up my marketing how sold some more, you know, work harder, go visit venues, you know, do interviews, whatever, you know, do things so I could actually really make sure to book more work.

Sylvie Gil: 20:12 I never sat on my butt and just let it fall apart. Yeah, absolutely. And having a financial goal for me I think was always a very, very good idea. There's been many times where I had to reinvent myself or push my marketing or do whatever it took to just, you know, really make my work sellable. And because it really doesn't happen magically. I mean, the more work you put into the business, the more you're going to business you're going to, and it's really funny because it's wedding photographers were shooting on weekends. Yes we do. But how much work are you putting in Monday through Friday? If you expect to make $100,000 a year, you should really put in a full time job kind of hours, which is eight to five Monday to Friday, maybe take Monday off Tuesday through Saturday. That's kind of how I felt about it. It's like if I would see that I was booking enough, I was in booking enough job, I would just like really push on the marketing or push on, you know, just redo my website or work so more, change it, whatever. Whatever I took.

Braedon Flynn: 21:19 Yeah. Four people. I'm imagining a lot of people that come and chat with you or at your workshops are wanting to be booking more, you know, they're probably, maybe they have their financial goals and they're not hitting them and not getting the work they want. What, what are things that you, like if you were starting over today and had to build your brand, what are the things you would be doing marketing wise or things to be getting out there and hustling?

Sylvie Gil: 21:42 Um, one, uh, one of the things that I do is I always try to make sure that my work is out there. So, um, I really strongly believe in featuring your work. Um, now, you know, with the decline of magazines it's harder, but I really make sure that I share my work with everybody. Uh, I always tell people like, you know, yeah, you took this beautiful photos of these flowers but you want to send this to the florists. And it's like, well they shouldn't enforce pay me or whatever. It's like, no, you know, this is how you get, you know, more people to just want to, how are you are talking about you? Like I love it when a client of mine goes to Napa Valley and said, oh, I talked to a florist and a planner and everybody and they all mentioned your name. It's because for 20 years I've been giving them photographs, you know, any really helps to just be generous with your work.

Sylvie Gil: 22:23 It really helps to, you know, feature your work, make sure it's out there and it's being seen. It really helps to have a website that functions on, you know, on your laptop, on your, on your phone. And it also really helps to just have a good business plan and make sure that you stick to it, you know, and, and sometimes having a business advisor, you know, is a, is a great idea. We had actually Sim from ID action consulting that comes to the workshop and he does, he does several business classes that aren't amazing. Several of the photographers or they've come hiring him afterwards to continue working with him because he's super good at it. And then pricing is the same thing. You know, people were so stiff with, they are, so like pricing is such a confusing thing out there. And I really believe like, you know, in 2008 during the recession, I wasn't charging what I charged now, not even close. I mean everybody was poor when he was struggling. I mean, you have to also adapt your pricing to the market a little bit and you have, you know, and you have to keep your integrity of course, you know, but adopt a pricing a little bit to the market without, you know, giving your work for free. Of course, you know, but when you're in the recession and you want to book weddings, you might have to figure something out, you know, with your pricing.

Braedon Flynn: 23:35 Do you find that most photographers that are coming to your workshops are not charging enough? Uh, no. I think a lot of people are just so scared to charge. I think what

Sylvie Gil: 23:46 maybe there was some of that for sure. A lot of people don't charge enough because they're scared. And what I tell them is like, hold your prices together, but push your marketing. Go out there on Tuesday morning, take your work, go show it to a bunch of venues and go show it to some planners, you know, go show it and go do a bridal fair goose, your marketing, but you should charge what you believe you're worth it. The right price is the price that you say with the right with a straight face. If you say a price, that icon, it says $3,000 to fly to Italy and shoot a wedding, then you're just like, you shouldn't do that because you know you're not making enough money and you shouldn't do that. But if any, if you say, well, I'm charging $50,000 you, she didn't do that either because you're uncomfortable with throwing that price at the client face.

Sylvie Gil: 24:29 Right? So the right price, in my opinion, is the price you think you're worth. And a price you can say with a straight face and then after that push the marketing behind it to just be able to sell yourself at that price and get what you're worth

Braedon Flynn: 24:46 With your workshop. So it sounds like Sam is there, who's brilliant and I love him. I know. He's so cool. What else happens at your workshops?

Sylvie Gil: 24:54 We have speakers. In the morning we do mostly business classes, so it's either me talking or the wedding planner or the florist, anybody has some kind of business advice to give. It isn't, is invited. We're going to have a few guest speakers, that I'm about to announce that are a really big deal and that are going to come and just talk about various things.

Sylvie Gil: 25:14 I'm all business related and mostly and uh, and then in the afternoon would do shoots and the shoots are set up so people can actually work in small groups, groups of four or five. So they actually don't step on each other's till I can't, I have a problem with these workshops or you see like 15 photographers shooting the same thing. I want people to be creative with their work. I want them to, I, you know, like if I give them a model and the gown I want, I'm excited when they take the model in the gown, in, in the hay or whatever, you know, at a, you know, in a doorframe or outside on the tree. It's like I want them to be creative with the work and actually do work that looks different than mine or the next person. And to do that, you really need to work in small groups.

Sylvie Gil: 25:55 You can be working in groups of the same, you know, level who fully and people that can be supportive with each other. And so we do the should groups in the shooting groups are like three to four people max and they have a whole half hour to just work with a bouquet, you know, or a table or whatever. And it's how many days in France? It's three days. Three full days. Yeah. In the chateau and weed killer food because our, our, our chef is a Michelin Star Chef, so it's amazing. And we socialize all day long. The, the team is really there with the attendees. So yeah, I mean I love it when a client, you know, like a not a client and attendee comes to the workshop and they said, I'm really struggling. Like, you know, gathering the work in my area. I feel like it's a depressed area for weddings. It's not the right place I need to move, you know? And if it, if people come from all sorts of areas of the world, I mean there are millions of weddings out there. How many weddings per year in America? I thought it was so many. Right. So if you're not booking 20 weddings a year, it's because you're doing something wrong with your marketing or your exposure because there are so many weddings out there. Right.

Braedon Flynn: 27:04 Yeah. I love that. I guess now in your business for being, doing as long as you have and the workshops and kids are probably older now, I know there are, what are things that are still hard or what are things that you, you find yourself struggling with now?

Sylvie Gil: 27:23 What do I find myself struggling with? It's gone. I'm actually a very comfortable place. Um, what is it that I find myself struggle. I'm sad than magazines are really going one, one by one that's really broken my heart, you know, to just like not see my work in print now among the, I think I'm going to make a book. I mean, it would, seeing the work in print, it's just so beautiful. I just, so there was that, um, where am I struggling with? Um, I saying no to a client that's really sweet, but I don't really think I'm going to be able to give her the work that, you know, she wants, you know, like let's say, uh, you know, a beautiful wedding that I'm never going to shoot it the way she wants it. That's always hard, you know? And I do do that. I have to do it because I want her to be happy with the photos, you know? Um, and uh, I don't know what else. That's it. I mean, I'm, I'm actually in a really good place right now. I really,

Braedon Flynn: 28:21 yeah, I mean I, I think it gets, it gets easier as having been in it for a long time. And can you put in the hustle and you've created your name and you've taken care of your vendors. You would, you would imagine that at this point you don't have to hustle quite as hard because you, you did that for so long and now you're established. So I mean, that makes sense. And that's really good that you're in that place.

Sylvie Gil: 28:43 Yeah. Yeah. And I love, I love this place. Creatively, I'm always, you know, it's not like a struggle, but it's always interesting to like find other avenues in my life, to be creative with my work. Everybody knows how much I love cooking. And for me that's like a very creative part of the, of the process. It's like, it's the place where I think about nothing but my onion and my garlic and I just think in my mind because the rest of the time and wasn't looking at images all around me. So I'm creatively, I think that, uh, having other avenues or where you can actually express your, your, you know, your creative self is really good. And so that's not a struggle. But like for example, right now I'm going to Morocco for four weeks with my all my cameras and I'm just going to be taking photos of whatever. Camels and sand dunes and tried to push myself creatively, you know, in colorful schemes and, and, and things like that. So it's not as struggled, but every year really try to, you know, get out of my comfort zone and try to do something new.

Braedon Flynn: 29:44 that's great

Sylvie Gil: 29:45 Just to get out of my comfort zone and you know, not have the same old, same old, same old thing going on with the exercise of creative muscles a little bit. You got it. That's exactly it. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's, it's not like a struggle, but it's really something that I have to really, you know, every year I put myself in that position. So like right now I'm trying to create a cookbook for fun just to shoot. And I'm doing these, you know, travel photos in Morocco and then when I come back in March and then I have a bazillian weddings to shoot and I'm sure it will be inspired in different way, you know?

Braedon Flynn: 30:18 Yeah. So we'll wrap it up pretty quick, but I was just wondering if you had, I mean,

Speaker 6: 30:24 hmm,

Braedon Flynn: 30:25 I have a big heart for younger photographers trying to get there and I know you do as well. Like what are some things that you see as maybe a common theme that if you could talk to a lot of people at once to encourage them or challenge them? Is there anything that you can think of that you'd like to,

Sylvie Gil: 30:42 it's exactly the same thing that I tell my kids. Braedon I mean, it's like if you have it in you don't quit. Just keep doing it. Keep hustling, keep trying, keep doing it. I hear it from people, they're like, I'm really want to do this. And then two years later they're like, oh, I wasn't making enough money. But it's like, that's because you didn't try hard enough. Don't quit. You know, if you have it in you, you want to do this, just keep working at it. There is a million weddings out there and, and some of them can be yours if you really try, you know, just don't quit. That's, that's what I tell everybody.

Braedon Flynn: 31:14 Yeah. And so if people want to find out more about your workshop, how do they go?

Sylvie Gil: 31:19 Okay, so it's on the website. It's on online sylviegilworkshops.com. And we have, I think we have like one seat left at the moment. It's filled up pretty fast and the Chateau is beautiful and we only have a certain amount of rooms so we can only take a certain amount of attendees, which is 15. So it's in April and a and it's really fun. And I have such good relationships with all of my attendees and, we really have a good time. Yeah. And thanks for mentioning it. I really appreciate it.

Braedon Flynn: 31:49 Totally. And for those of you out there that don't know how to spell her name, it's s, y, l, v, I. E. And then Gil is Gil?

Sylvie Gil: 31:57 Yes. What else? Yeah, I really do it with my heart. It's my little baby and I really, I really adore. I adore being there with everybody.

Braedon Flynn: 32:06 And last very important question because you corrected me on my Instagram stories once everybody says the Croix.

Sylvie Gil: 32:17 I know. How do you say it? So in America they say La Croix and I think it's an American brand. Yup, it is. In France it would be. Yeah.

Braedon Flynn: 32:29 Yeah. But even even like the company Lacroix calls it Lacroix.

Sylvie Gil: 32:33 Yeah. Yeah. But it's not quite, well that probably sounds better, right? Like I dunno, maybe. Yeah. Thank you for clearing that up for many people out there. I know. They were all wondering. Oh really? Yeah. Lacroix is what the company wants you to call it. I think. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 32:49 Those Americans look thanks so much for just sharing your knowledge and with everybody.

Sylvie Gil: 32:54 Thank you so much Braedon. It was really fun and I really appreciate it and I wish you a good evening with your kids.